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标题: 柴油车和汽油车？车况，年份相当该选哪个更适合日常 [打印本页]

作者: sarah20100909 时间: 2013-2-22 23:33:54 标题: 柴油车和汽油车？车况，年份相当该选哪个更适合日常

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作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-22 23:35:11

要卖柴油，首选标志和福特现代的i30也不错~

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-2-22 23:46:41

其实lz... 这问题你要先让人家知道你一年约跑多少km 平均都跑那种路况等等因素在来衡量不一定同一款车都符合每个人的求~

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-22 23:47:49

casanova 发表于 2013-2-22 23:46
其实lz... 这问题你要先让人家知道你一年约跑多少km 平均都跑那种路况等等因素在来衡量不一定同 ...

香蕉，签名换回bunana吧~

作者: sarah20100909 时间: 2013-2-22 23:52:14

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作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-23 00:05:57

那么就选福特蒙迪欧吧，2。0T柴油

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-2-23 12:51:01

tongandyu 发表于 2013-2-22 23:47
香蕉，签名换回bunana吧~

好卑...

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-23 16:07:44

casanova 发表于 2013-2-23 12:51
好卑...

这个不错，哈哈~

作者: sky9 时间: 2013-2-23 16:40:10

casanova 发表于 2013-2-23 12:51
好卑...

B1 B2.

作者: 勤劳的处男 时间: 2013-2-23 18:41:42

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作者: casanova 时间: 2013-2-23 21:18:51

勤劳的处男发表于 2013-2-23 18:41
柴油修起来很贵的。。。买新一点的好。。。

大大的是 mondeo tdci ?

作者: johnz79 时间: 2013-2-24 23:17:02

据说柴油的，一年要3万公里以上才合适，还有经常脱重的东西，柴油还有Road User Charge，保养也贵，万一坏了，修起来也贵，如果只是用来上下班，堵车的话，不合适。

作者: 勤劳的处男 时间: 2013-2-25 20:03:42

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作者: 爱国爱港 时间: 2013-2-27 21:53:15

本帖最后由爱国爱港于 2013-2-28 00:06 编辑

johnz79 发表于 2013-2-24 23:17
据说柴油的，一年要3万公里以上才合适，还有经常脱重的东西，柴油还有Road User Charge，保养也贵，万一坏了 ...

以下英语狠评柴油引擎，节录自Dog and Lemon Guide全新韩国现代i30的车评：
Before you go rushing off and buying one of the diesels, however, there’s something you should be aware of. Many buyers are still attracted to diesels as a way of saving fuel, and therefore, money. Sadly, the opposite is often the case. Diesel vehicles usually cost more than petrol vehicles because diesel engines are more costly to build. Various studies comparing the running costs of a petrol powered small vehicle versus a diesel-powered small vehicle have concluded that the average driver would take several years, at least, merely to get back the extra cost of the diesel engine.

Even in England, where petrol prices are ruinously high, diesel vehicles are often false economy. Analysis by car valuation firm Glass’s Guide, showed that buying a secondhand diesel only makes sense if you are driving at least 10,000 miles or 16,000km per year. According to Glass’s Guide: “The majority of owners of diesel cars in the UK are throwing money down the drain”.

This sad truth applies to most low-mileage diesel owners around the world. Servicing costs for diesels are also generally far higher than for the equivalent petrol engine. However, there’s a bigger fear with diesels: many modern diesels have lost the sturdy reliability that you could take for granted on diesels thirty years ago. As a general rule, the smaller and the higher tech the engine, the more problems it gives.

D & L的车评一直是偏激，车版更有人指不专业。小弟本住尽信书不如无书的精神，帖出D & L英语车评志在抛砖引玉，刺激各位车版网友理性讨论

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-27 21:58:42

爱国爱港发表于 2013-2-27 21:53
以下英语用狠评柴油引擎，节录自Dog and Lemon Guide全新韩国现代i30的车论：
Before you go rushing of ...

呵呵，你还是不死心啊，我无语鸟~

作者: 爱国爱港 时间: 2013-2-27 22:10:00

tongandyu 发表于 2013-2-27 21:58
呵呵，你还是不死心啊，我无语鸟~

我已经说欢迎大家理性讨论

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-27 22:13:55

爱国爱港发表于 2013-2-27 22:10
我已经说欢迎大家理性讨论

油耗和动力，上次我已经和你说过拉~

至于保养，我了解到，福特的滤芯比较贵，是我们平时汽油机器的一倍，但是按照汽油机半年或者1万公里的保养周期，柴油机一年或者2万公里的保养周期来算，价格等于一样。
标志的滤芯比较便宜，比汽油机的还要便宜。

然后是机油了，我开汽油车时候，用的最多的是加实多的5w30，最便宜的时候，一桶70多块。
大叔已经找到最好的total机油的供应商，目前算下来，10刀多点一升，貌似，比我之前买加实多还要便宜。。。

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-2-27 22:47:33

本帖最后由 casanova 于 2013-2-27 23:06 编辑

以下是小的亲生体验...柴油保养肯定贵??? 未必! 比较贵的....基本上是要看车款. 目前我可以大声地说柴油车在auk...的交通状况如果你每年跑2w km... 偶尔塞几次车......是可以真心考虑买 3.5ton 以下的柴油车.... 因为 3.5ton以上的化柴油车税是02... 贵很多. 同时因为auckland 的traffic 常常需要低扭矩在车里面乱钻启动停止这时候柴油车的低转低扭可以完全发挥它的特点... 加上柴油机的特性相信爱开冷气的车友们也是个福音... 小排量汽油车长期开冷气还要同时要启动的马力真心吃不消..... 要是可以... 同时也牺牲了油耗....

一年2w km 车友们会觉得很多吗? 基本上... 你跑个 city to 东区来回就约50km... 了... 如果你每天有平均跑这距离或者爱乱跑的车友们... 基本上你一年就是跑 2w km..... 这还不包含出去玩得....km...
小的小小柴油车... 开到最近的心得就是我发现保养成本竟然跟之前 txxda 一样....甚至更低 (因为我txxda.. 都是 5000km 5000km 换油因为是汽油发动机....) 车友们信不? 我自己也大吃一惊我的 transmission oil 也比 ns-2 还便宜.....(当然我没买...dsg.. 可是这又是另外一个话题) 可是车友们会问? 可是diesel 还有 diesel filter 要换? 这就得看车种了.. 像我的diesel fuel filter 每6w 换一次...一个也才 4x刀...当然有些vw 家族系列的甚至有自带 self cleaning 的.. 可以称更久... 我的oil change接下来按照manufacture specs.. 15000kms or 1 yr 换一次就行了... 甚至我 2w5km 换也可以... 因为这款符合manufacture specs 的diesel engine oil 是 longlife 的... 当然我爱车所以我也不可能...等到2w km换..... 没有错 d&L 东西有时候有道理有时候东西偏激可是这类的东西仅供参考!! 甚至有时候看看就好....何必呢...
要在自己每天开的不同路况选不同的车符合自己需求才更重要....

PS. 如有错误求大婶们更正...

作者: johnz79 时间: 2013-2-27 23:02:21

casanova 发表于 2013-2-27 22:47
以下是小的亲生体验...柴油保养肯定贵??? 未必! 比较贵的....基本上是要看车款. 目前我可以大声地说柴油 ...

我想知道的是，柴油车的Road User Charge是多少钱，怎么算的？我看网站上，是不是48刀每1000公里？我大概是弄错了，请指教。我公司里的车，都是要求如果每年超过3万公里，用柴油核算，不然就是汽油。
还有汽油车保养，我现在在AA保养也是一万公里，或者半年一次，我每年大概开2万公里左右，这样频率和柴油车是一样的了，我看AA对柴油车的价格也贵30块。

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-2-27 23:07:53

johnz79 发表于 2013-2-27 23:02
我想知道的是，柴油车的Road User Charge是多少钱，怎么算的？我看网站上，是不是48刀每1000公里？我大概 ...

http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resource ... tonne-vehicles.html
我不是专业的... 可是这应该会让你清楚点...yes .. 48 per 1000km

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-2-28 00:47:23

本帖最后由 ilmaro 于 2013-2-28 10:31 编辑

选择开什么车，用什么发动机，是个人选择。
其它的我想我不必说了，我只想说：柴油机的维修成本高，更多的原因是人为性质因素造成的。大部分柴油机上的零件，并不比汽油机贵，也并不比汽油机复杂。只是因为柴油机结构简单，可靠，少电子控制少机械维修，所以在后续的零件价格上，原厂出于成本控制而提高了零件价格，或者是后续的行业零件供应商提高了价格。因为流通量不大，这就是资本主义商品经济的特点。一个完全纸杯型的油滤，它的生产成本会高于汽油机的一体式油滤吗？不会！但是价格依然卖的比汽油机贵！何来的道理？没有！但市场就是这样存在的。这一路上，参与的细分行业几乎都是一路对柴油机收费加价，甚至一些只是沾边的都一样。这不合理，可你拿它没有办法，这就是社会现状。
如果D&L想要控诉，那控诉的对像不应该是柴油机本身，而该是这个体制本身！他，也是这恶性环中的一环。
柴油机也罢，汽油机也好，各有各的特点，适应着不同的用车环境。选择权本身就归你自己所有，但有时人是没得选择权的。都说柴油机排放不好，要征收柴油税，可税征去了政府专项做了什么相应的工作没有？没有！有的只是政府官员的收入高于老百姓而已！政府，也是这环中的一环。不是吗？可你不交税行吗？汽油机没有排放了？核能没有副作用了？烧煤发电就环境保护了？只是一个征税理由罢了吧。。。。。
放眼看远方，这个世界上石油越来越少，我只知道柴油可以工业合成，汽油最起码目前还不行吧？试问，谁的生命力会更久一些？这就是为什么这些年来，各国柴油发动机大发展，大行其道的原因。试问D&L到了那没有汽油机的年代，再回头看自己写的文章，情何以堪？？
所以，不妨开放心胸，海纳百川，理性分析，形成自已比较客观，经得起考验的思想为好。
人的一生，就是如此，刚开始要博闻广记，行千里路读万卷书。成熟了，就尽信书，不如无书。老了，自己写书去。。。。。

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-28 08:14:25

ilmaro 发表于 2013-2-28 00:47
选择开什么车，用什么发动机，是个人选择。
其它的我想我不必说了，我只想说：柴油机的维修成本高，更多的 ...

完了完了，柴油机要涨价了~大家速度买啊~晚了就没了。。。。

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-2-28 11:32:58

tongandyu 发表于 2013-2-28 07:14
完了完了，柴油机要涨价了~大家速度买啊~晚了就没了。。。。

柴油车近年来，一直在涨价和紧缺中，你看拍卖行，哪次柴油车流拍了？？

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-28 11:49:43

ilmaro 发表于 2013-2-28 11:32
柴油车近年来，一直在涨价和紧缺中，你看拍卖行，哪次柴油车流拍了？？

上次那黑色的,现在卖15900,哈哈~

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-2-28 11:58:48

tongandyu 发表于 2013-2-28 10:49
上次那黑色的,现在卖15900,哈哈~

308?????降价了？？？

作者: tongandyu 时间: 2013-2-28 12:33:25

ilmaro 发表于 2013-2-28 11:58
308?????降价了？？？

是啊,那人1万4千7拍到的,拿到手大概1万5吧....

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-2-28 12:35:47

tongandyu 发表于 2013-2-28 11:33
是啊,那人1万4千7拍到的,拿到手大概1万5吧....

14700+415嘛。。。。。最多了。。。。价格合适了。。。。

作者: keepower 时间: 2013-2-28 21:55:42

ilmaro 发表于 2013-2-27 23:47
选择开什么车，用什么发动机，是个人选择。
其它的我想我不必说了，我只想说：柴油机的维修成本高，更多的 ...

RUC主要是为了照顾各种农场车辆啊大家跟着买单不过柴油车颗粒排放确实不低啊

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-2-28 22:58:54

keepower 发表于 2013-2-28 20:55
RUC主要是为了照顾各种农场车辆啊大家跟着买单不过柴油车颗粒排放确实不低啊

是的，排放上是比汽油车差了点了，但现代的柴油车已很出色的，在排放上。我想，更多的，就是为了征税。。。。

作者: 爱国爱港 时间: 2013-3-12 16:31:52

ilmaro 发表于 2013-2-28 22:58
是的，排放上是比汽油车差了点了，但现代的柴油车已很出色的，在排放上。我想，更多的，就是为了征税。。 ...

http://www.dogandlemon.com/articles/diesels

Diesels often seem cheaper because the buyer is hypnotised by the apparently low cost of fuel instead of looking at the entire cost of ownership, including road taxes, increased servicing costs and the cost of an expensive engine rebuild that grows ever more likely with every passing kilometre.

There are a few things you should know about diesels:

1) Diesels cost more to buy. In almost every case, new vehicles with diesel engines cost significantly more than the petrol equivalent.

Recently, car buyers have developed an unhealthy attraction to diesels for fuel economy reasons, especially European diesels. You should be aware that, however much you may save in fuel, European cars fitted with diesels have a shocking track record for reliability, and when they break, they break your bank account as well.

2) Diesels are generally noisier than petrol engines, although you may not notice this when you’re inside the car, because diesel-powered cars are often well soundproofed.

3) Diesel engines generally cost much more to service & repair than petrol engines. Diesel engines need to be far stronger than petrol engines. This additional strength translates into additional expense at fix-up time.

4) Diesel is often a lot less per litre than petrol, but diesel-powered vehicles must pay road tax in many countries, which drastically raises the true cost of the fuel.

5) Diesels may not be much more economical for smaller vehicles. Various tests comparing the running costs of a petrol-powered small car versus a diesel-powered small car have concluded that the average driver would take several years at least, merely to get back the extra cost of the diesel engine.

Diesels aren’t all bad: there are two groups that do well from owning diesels: owners of new commercial vehicles and owners of large offroad vehicles. Why?

New commercial vehicles are often covering huge distances and their owners are primarily concerned with keeping running costs as low as possible. Because a new vehicle is under warranty, fuel and servicing are likely to be the biggest costs that commercial owners face. Of these costs, fuel is by far the biggest. If they’re doing big mileages, a well-serviced new diesel can be significantly cheaper to operate, both in terms of fuel costs alone and in terms of overall costs of ownership. Because the vehicle will probably be sold long before the engine needs rebuilding, new owners don’t care about the cost of diesel engine repair. It’s the next guy’s problem.  Lastly, because the warranty will require that the vehicle is regularly serviced, the engine is less likely to give trouble for its first owner.

It’s the person who buys the ageing diesel vehicle off the commercial operator who may be a loser – it’s far more likely to require expensive repairs & far less likely to have a decent guarantee.

Owners of large offroaders with proven engines such as those fitted to the early Nissan Patrols and Toyota Landcruisers are also likely winners.

There’s a rough rule of thumb with automotive diesels that the larger the engine, the more likely it is to be reliable, and vice versa.  Older Nissan Patrol and Toyota Landcruiser engines have been known to do 500,000km without major repairs. Also, there are many rural areas where you simply can’t buy petrol because there are no petrol stations. Most farmers, by comparison, have easy access to diesel.

However, unless you’re buying new or buying a vehicle with a proven service history, you don’t know what the inside of the engine is like. One thing that everyone agrees on is that diesels are often hellishly expensive to fix when they do go wrong. So, there’s a general rule that if you don’t know a diesel’s history, you should avoid it altogether, unless a diesel mechanic tells you otherwise.

The bad news:

You probably think that modern diesels are better than earlier models but you may be wrong. Although many improvements have been made over the years, big, reliable, chugging diesels are rapidly going the way of the dinosaur. The ever-growing need for better fuel economy, less pollution and greater performance has meant that diesel engines have been pushed beyond their limits by over-eager vehicle manufacturers.

Traditional diesel engines were heavily built and rarely worked very hard. Because they rarely worked very hard, the engine lasted a long time.

By comparison, most modern diesels have turbochargers – giant air pumps – pushing pressurised air through them to make the engine work at least a quarter harder. As the engine works at least a quarter harder, so the engine parts and cooling system have to work at least a quarter harder. Some of this extra strain can be taken up with skilful engine designs and higher quality parts, but there’s a limit to this.

The latest generation of diesel engines, termed common-rail diesels, are the most efficient diesel engines ever made, and when fitted to a car offer good levels of power and acceleration comparable to petrol engines.

However, many turbocharged common-rail diesel engines work harder than any other diesels in history. No matter how solidly they are made, we do not believe that they will last as long as their less hard-working cousins of old.
France is the world centre for small diesel engines. Diesels account for most of the new cars sold in France and in Europe generally.

There is already plenty of evidence of problems with the new generation of European common rail diesel engines, even when relatively new.  However, there are far worse problems down the track, after the vehicles leave warranty. European diesel engines (like their petrol siblings) are designed to be used in one vehicle for a fixed period of time and then disposed of.  They are computer controlled and everything from the high tech fuel pumps to the exhaust system is designed to work together as one whole unit.  Without the computer and the sensors in the exhaust pipe, the diesel will not run properly.

The European carmakers know this of course – in five or ten years’ time when their diesel becomes uneconomic to fix or will no longer pass emissions checks, they’ll be waiting around to sell you a whole new vehicle. The rest of the car will probably be junk.

Peugeot diesels use a silicon carbide honeycomb filter that absorbs pollution, then every 500km or so the filter system oxidizes the absorbed pollutants by injecting a small amount of fuel and a rare-earth-derived additive called Eolys to superheat the exhaust and burn off the soot left behind by burning diesel.

Very clever no doubt, and we believe Peugeot’s claim that the system eliminates 95% of pollution – when new. However, given Peugeot’s woeful reputation for reliability even with existing technology, hands up everyone who thinks this system will still be working reliably and economically in ten years’ time? Thought not.

Compare this to the modern Japanese petrol engine: it’s worth remembering that the basic Toyota Corolla petrol engine is not all that different to the models that they were making twenty years ago; it’s just somewhat more complex and somewhat more efficient. It’s proven, durable technology that is cheap to buy, cheap to service, cheap to fix, and if the car is too old to make engine repair economic, you can get a good, cheap petrol engine from just about any wrecker.

What about Japanese diesel engines? The older, smaller diesel engines by Mazda & Toyota were fairly dreadful. Nissan has always been a market leader, until recently, when some new high tech diesels started giving grief at a young age. Ditto Isuzu.

New European diesels require a very clean type of diesel fuel, but this new diesel fuel often wrecks the diesel pump on older Japanese models.

Outside of Europe, sales of diesel vehicles were expected to fall, but the opposite happened as fuel prices rose.

We’d advise you to avoid diesels altogether unless your needs can only really be met by having a diesel engine. If you must have a diesel, buy new or with caution, perhaps great caution, and for God’s sake have it checked out by a diesel mechanic before you pay over any money

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-3-12 17:08:14

爱国爱港发表于 2013-3-12 16:31
http://www.dogandlemon.com/articles/diesels

Diesels often seem cheaper because the buyer is hyp ...

人家大婶 no english... 你这样给他看他看不懂啦.... 翻译一下爱国哥

作者: ilmaro 时间: 2013-3-12 17:14:29

casanova 发表于 2013-3-12 16:08
人家大婶 no english... 你这样给他看他看不懂啦.... 翻译一下爱国哥

不需要。。。。。

作者: casanova 时间: 2013-3-12 17:15:56

ilmaro 发表于 2013-3-12 17:14
不需要。。。。。

都会看了语言学校也不用报了啦... 英文那么好... 我知道你是去看mm 的

作者: 爱国爱港 时间: 2013-3-13 00:11:31

本帖最后由爱国爱港于 2013-3-13 00:11 编辑

casanova 发表于 2013-3-12 17:08
人家大婶 no english... 你这样给他看他看不懂啦.... 翻译一下爱国哥

大哥，练练英语嘛！你知道现在很多愤青五毛党欧洲车迷在攻击小弟，我就是故意发英文

作者: 我是小枪 时间: 2013-3-13 21:16:55

爱国爱港果然香港出身，英语太好曲高和寡啊

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